Building Community and Revenue Through Growing Organically with Alice Varon from Certified Naturally Grown
In this episode of the Direct Farm Podcast, we're delighted to host Alice Varon, Executive Director at Certified Naturally Grown. Listen in to Alice and Allyssa discuss the differences in labels like CNG and USDA organic and how their community, built around farming sustainably and organically have helped its members.
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Intro
Allyssa Knutson: [00:00:26] Welcome everyone to the Direct Farm Podcast. We've got a great conversation with you today. I'm very excited to welcome our guest from Certified Naturally Grown or CNG for short. Today we are interviewing Alice Varon the Executive Director for Certified Naturally Grown welcome Alice!
Alice Varon: [00:00:46] Thank you so much, It's great to be here Allyssa.
Allyssa Knutson: [00:00:49] Great to have you here. Maybe just to get started, I'd love to hear and for our listeners as well, to hear a little bit more about the history of CNG, maybe tell us about your founder, how the organization was started and just a little bit more about your background.
Alice Varon: [00:01:03] Yeah, sure. So CNG was founded by Farmers back in 2002. When the National Organic Program took effect in the Hudson Valley. They've been farming organically for many, many years, and we're committed to that way. Producing food for their local communities. And were suddenly faced with a decision when the National Organic Program took effect, it became illegal to use the word organic to describe your Farm or your Farming practices, unless you went through the new certification process that was overseen by the us Department of Agriculture.
And so, these Farmers in the Hudson Valley decided to create a alternative called Certified Naturally Grown, and it grew from a small group of, growers who were sort of running it on a volunteer basis to quickly become a National Organization of Farmers around the country when they learned of it, thought,
'geez, that, that describes me. I'm very committed to growing food in this way. But the new program just doesn't quite feel like a right fit for me. So I'm gonna check it out.' And before long, we had Farms in 47 States throughout United States and started just certifying the produce operations and added livestock pretty soon thereafter and the standards for both produce and livestock are based on the national organic standards.
In 2010, we expanded to include beekeepers. So I'm sort of moving ahead into the current times here. But I guess you did ask how I got involved. I was living in the Hudson Valley and looking for the next big project I was going to work on and. Making phone calls to Farmers in the area and happened to call the founder of CNG who was more interested in telling me about this project Certified Naturally Grown and looking for a new person to run it.
So it worked out well for me to do it. My background is in organizing. I love building organizations, so it was actually a really good fit for me. And I'm glad to be doing it today.
Allyssa Knutson: [00:03:10] That's great. And that's great to hear how much growth that you've experienced in such a short amount of time. And also to know that this is a passion of yours as well. Maybe touch on a little bit more about the types of Farms you serve. Do you mentioned beekeepers as well as produce. What other farms do you serve?
Alice Varon: [00:03:27] Yeah. So the majority of certified naturally grown producers are growing fresh produce. We do have livestock producers as well as beekeepers and in 2016, when we added certification for mushroom growers and also for aquaponics producers. We do certify maple producers as well and fresh cut flowers growers are a growing portion of our membership.
Allyssa Knutson: [00:03:58] Definitely. And that's great to see that you serve multiple farmers across the country and 47 States or all 50 States now?
Alice Varon: [00:04:05] I think it's 47. You know, it fluctuates, we have folks being added and removed all the time. Usually Rhode Island in North Dakota, or don't quite make the list, but most other States do tend to have a Certified Natural Grown producers in them and several Canadian provinces as well.
Allyssa Knutson: [00:04:22] Definitely. And just to give farmers that option of, you know, you mentioned fit, so what is the best fit for me and for my Farm to pursue USDA certified organic, but there's also the Certified Naturally Grown label as well. Maybe touch on the difference between the two labels and just give our listeners a broad strokes overview of the differences there.
Alice Varon: [00:04:42] Yeah, sure. That's a great question. We do have a lot in common with USDA organic program because our standards for produce and livestock are based on those organic standards. So just like organic Farmers Certified Naturally Grown Farmers, produce food without using synthetic chemicals or GMOs, and the livestock producers use feed that's grown without synthetic inputs.
And
Alice Varon - CNG: [00:05:09] the main difference is our certification model, which relies on a more grassroots approach where farmers are the ones conducting the onsite inspections.
Alice Varon: [00:05:20] It's a peer to peer approach that's endorsed and recommended by IFOAM Organics International. It's an international body that promotes organic agriculture as a way to include small scale producers.
And it's more accessible because we have less of an emphasis on paperwork, which Farmers really like. And tends to be more affordable than the USDA organic program. It's really a question too of, what are the markets that the Farm is trying to serve? And so sometimes the USDA program makes the most sense, especially if you want to access wholesale markets, but
Alice Varon - CNG: [00:05:54] for those producers who are growing for their local community, selling directly to their customers, certified naturally grown is often a very good fit for them.
Alice Varon: [00:06:06] Sometimes many of our members have been Certified Naturally Grown for several years, they grow and they get to a scale where they do want to access wholesale markets and they add on organic certification and and hold both at the same time. And that's very important to them to retain that connection to our organization, as a reflection of their commitment to being a part of their local community, but the organic label give them access to those new markets that really insist on that particular label, if you want credit for your practices, but not every farm is in that situation. And
Alice Varon - CNG: [00:06:41] we think it's important for them to have choices of different ways to verify their practices and this is one that many farmers find very attractive.
Allyssa Knutson: [00:06:49] And I can see why based on the size of your farm and your operations, what your goals are beyond the fit, but also the size there. And to know that there's the option to hold both certifications too, for Farms who, you know, are growing their operations. And they see that perspective of things. So that's great to know that that's an option as well.
So I'd love to just dive a little bit more deeper into what is CNG and in terms of the direction that you're headed in the new developments that you have coming through, can you share with our listeners just some exciting updates that you have coming through that they might be listening in?
Alice Varon: [00:07:22] Yeah, sure. I'm really excited about a new initiative. We just launched this past winter to provide more education to our members and beyond on production practices that meet CNG standards, there's a lot of folks getting into Farming and very committed to ecological practices. And we know from reviewing many hundreds of applications over the years, that there are folks who have all the right intentions and believe that they're Farming according to the standards that we expect.
And then it turns out actually they have to make some adjustments and typically, they're very happy to do that and to learn that that was something they needed to do, but we're now able to offer proactive support to Farmers beyond just assessing their application. And we're calling it the Farmer Learning Collaborative, which is a little different than a lot of Farming workshops that have been out there and providing value over the years from other organizations.
And keeping with our grassroots and peer-to-peer approach. Our Farmer Learning Collaborative really emphasizes the exchange of knowledge between Certified Naturally Grown producers. And we brought in some of our most experienced Farmers to provide the content for these sessions where we take a different topic each week, have the experienced Farmers talk in discussion with each other about the challenges they've faced and how they've handled it.
And it's just such richness for, especially beginning Farmers to have the opportunity to sit in and witness those conversations and learn from them and realize that others are facing this very same challenges and learn how they're dealing with them. So we're going to extend that in the coming year and offer some more programming, especially for our newer members to help them get off on the right foot, because we want them to succeed. We want them to produce abundant, healthy crops using high standards that will not only help them stay certified, but protect the soil and the water and give their customers the best quality food they can.
Allyssa Knutson: [00:09:29] Great. And it's great to see too, just the peer to peer aspect of it. You know, being able to relate to another producer of I'm going through the same thing, or maybe I've been through the certification process. I understand what goes into it. So that's great to see that, you know, the peers are able to turn around and help a fellow producer. Who's walking through the same certification process that they may have walked through years prior.
Alice Varon: [00:09:52] Absolutely and it's not just the certification process, but the process of growing crops successfully. And honestly, I think it's very rewarding for the experienced Farmers to be able to pass on some of that knowledge that they've worked so hard to get over many years of Farming to sort of help spare some folks coming along the hardships that they may have faced and the mistakes they've made can serve a larger purpose.
Allyssa Knutson: [00:10:18] And I know you have a couple other new developments as well. Would you like to share some of those too for our listeners?
Alice Varon: [00:10:24] Yeah, we're pretty excited about a new initiative that we've got off the ground before the pandemic hit, where we wanted to build on the peer to peer aspect of our certification. It's actually building on the community oriented aspects. So we now officially have the option for community stakeholders to observe the on-farm inspections.
They're not there to assess they're there to observe. And then they certainly can ask questions when it's over, but to add another layer of transparency to the verification process, you know, we have a high commitment to having transparency and we manifest that on our website, includes all the different certification documents for each a producer, that's certified. They all have a profile that lists those. Their application and the inspection reports. And we thought, you know, what better way to include more people than to have somebody. One or two people maximum, observant inspection and then sign off on it. And we've had great feedback.
We had to sort of put it on pause during the pandemic, because it was tricky to get people together and not something we necessarily wanted to encourage, but. Going forward. We know that it's a way for our members to have more visibility in their community to have an added layer of verification that the inspection happened and the, all the questions were asked that it was rigorous and also to just have more people see what goes on. What it takes to produce food in this way, have more community awareness of the extremely hard work that goes into producing that big bunch of beautiful beats that they're taking home to cook.
Allyssa Knutson: [00:12:15] And that ties nicely into I guess my next question for you would be, you know, talking about certification from an educational standpoint. So making sure that any producer that comes to CNG they're interested in pursuing or carrying out the steps to become CNG certified. What would you recommend to them?
I know you on your website, you have a list of requirements and guidelines as well, but ensuring that the producers that are interested are also a good fit to pursue a CNG certification.
Alice Varon: [00:12:44] Yeah. For each of our five certification types, each one has a page where we do have a link to the complete standards for that type, whether it's produce, livestock, mushroom, aquaponics, or apiary certification. So that's like all the nitty gritty. In addition, we have frequently asked questions for folks, if they want to just, you know, Do a first pass, like, is this even worth considering. Folks generally, I think have a good sense whether they're a good fit and then the details that may need adjustment do tend to come out through the application process.
But really we do recommend that folks make sure to review our standards, to make sure that it is a good fit for their current practices or that they could make modest adjustments to meet those standards. And if it does seem like a good fit we recommend they fill out an application, which they can do online. And we get back to them within a week.
Allyssa Knutson: [00:13:42] It's pretty quick turnaround time.
Alice Varon: [00:13:44] Yeah. It's a pretty good turnaround time for sure and we know Farmers are busy and the season is heating up. So the sooner we get back to them, you know, we want to make sure we respond while it's on top of mind and other things don't intervene, but we also are happy to answer questions by email or phone our contact info is readily available and we can quickly answer any questions folks have. And we're going to be offering some, you know, webinars like is CNG a good fit for your Farm, you know, intro to CNG one-on-one that folks can always tap into as well.
Allyssa Knutson: [00:14:19] that's great. And then for the producers who are onboarded, it's a good fit to become CNG certified. What are, I guess, some of the the feedback that you've received from those producers in terms of. The most beneficial aspects of membership and also just special insights that they receive. You kind of touch on the educational aspect as well as the peer to peer aspect of networking. But what are some of the most beneficial aspects of membership for CNG members?
Alice Varon: [00:14:46] Well, it's really fun because. It does vary of course, from one farm to the next. But you would think that the first answer is marketing and the advantages of getting into more, more selective Farmer's Markets or grocery stores. And that is definitely an advantage, but what comes up over and over again is the sense of being a part of a like-minded community and having relationships that bear fruit in ways that you can't always predict ahead of time.
But that sense of, you know, because I know this farmer from my CNG inspection, I can then go to them and ask them for advice. Or we can go in on a bulk order of livestock feed or, you know, farming supplies that ends up saving many hundreds of dollars, but.
It's not even just the money saved or those tips. It's such a knowledge intensive, unique, and somewhat isolating occupation that having a sense of being a part of this community, where, they know what you're struggling with and you can turn to other Farmers for the support you need.
That sense of community is really what comes up over and over again. But yeah, it's also, you know, we have really great marketing materials and it's, you know, it's not expensive, once you're certified You can get twist ties to a bunch of your leafy greens, you can get stickers to put on your packaging or your squash.
And we have signage for folks. And of course there's social media attention that we give our members. There's definitely marketing perks as well. And. You know, it's all of a piece, it's a point of pride. Not everyone qualifies to be part of CNG and they can't all stay if they don't continue to meet the standards or the requirements.
So it is, you know, a sense of pride that, look, I'm a part of this group, and you see the other Farmers that participate and you respect them, and it feels really good. To be able to say I'm Certified Naturally Grown Farmers. So sometimes that's enough.
Allyssa Knutson: [00:16:52] well, and especially thinking about this past year too, I know there've been so many changes and a lot of producers, farmers have had to pivot out of necessity just given the current market and what's been going on and everyone's at home. You know, and so trying to figure out a way to reach your consumers and your buyers in a way that maybe you haven't in the past and exploring the ideas there.
So maybe touch on a little bit more about how the pandemic has affected business for your members. And if you have a success story in mind, as well as a farmer who was able to pivot or adjust their operations to reach consumers where they're at at home.
Alice Varon: [00:17:30] Yeah, it's been a real mixed bag for our members during this past year, dealing with the impacts of the pandemic. Certainly those supplying restaurants and catering companies saw their markets disappear overnight. Some were able to recover, but some shut down. We, you know,
Alice Varon - CNG: [00:17:45] it's definitely been hard on Farmers over this past year, but for most of our members, because we're working with Farmers selling locally and direct to customers, they've never seen such high demand.
Alice Varon: [00:17:58] And the big challenge was just to meet that demand safely. And so we've tried to help them navigate those changes. Especially those at Farmer's Markets. We created some new signs to help customers navigate new conventions at the Farmer's market, like wearing a mask that seems normal now. But back then the idea of going to a Farmer's market wearing something on your face, it was. Unusual to say the least. And so we made some fun signs that had an image of a mask, and it said wearing a mask keeps your Farmer safe or keeps your Farmer healthy. And then another one with gloved hands holding lettuce, saying, "let us serve you" because in places, they didn't want the customers touching all the produce. And a cute cartoon of a carrot in salary going shopping that said, keep six feet apart.
So, you know, having fun with design and humor to sort of convey these new conventions on behalf of our, you know, make that easily accessible to our members is something that we tried to do. And yeah, so that was the big challenge is just sort of adjusting how you would normally do things. In a way that was safe and not cost prohibitive. So the members who were best positioned to we're already supplying local markets using online platforms, they were the ones best positioned to scale up relatively easily. And yeah, so it really varied, but I would say as a whole, our community. Is doing okay.
I'm glad to say. And you know,
Alice Varon - CNG: [00:19:35] that might be one of the silver linings of this very, very difficult year is that folks were starting to look for food that was produced closer to home and diminish the links in the food chain the source to their table.
Alice Varon: [00:19:53] And fortunately our members were well positioned to do that for the most part.
Allyssa Knutson: [00:19:59] That's great to hear and also from a communication standpoint of how to communicate to the producers, but also how to communicate to the buyers too, because in this time it's all about communication. You can't communicate enough with what's been going on. So keeping everyone safe and finding, you know, the best way to go about it and in a cute way with the cartoons or, you know, whatever you have to do to make it a little bit less scary, but also being.
You know, realistic of, you know, the times too, and making sure everyone's safe is very important. So focusing, I guess, maybe more on the tactics. I know there's. Probably a laundry list of ideas or, you know, different ways that producers have gone about implementing an online business strategy or how to go to direct to market. But what are some of those tactical steps that you've noticed? Producers have used time and time again, to take their business from wholesale retail and flipping it or adding in direct to consumer or delivery.
Alice Varon: [00:20:55] Well, obviously Barn2Door is one good option it's, you know, ready to go. And there's a number of, of such platforms. I know from folks in our community that for many years, actually, the idea of having a online Farmer's market has been appealing to allow customers to place an order. Through the Farm, the online Farmer's market.
And then the Farmers don't have to stay there at the pickup spot all day because the customers have, pre-ordered what they wanted and they just stopped by and pick it up. So it may be that the pandemic accelerated the use the adoption of some of these online tools, but I feel like. It's just not easy to pivot all of a sudden.
And it's really maybe just a cultural shift. That's been happening over several years that Farmers are looking for more efficient ways to get their food in the hands of their customers and still be supplying their own local community. And the online platform options seem to be really a great way to do that.
Allyssa Knutson: [00:22:02] I think taking it small too, you know, figuring out what's a small step that I can take today, but maybe not doing the whole kit and caboodle right now, but figuring out how can I implement small changes over time. To make that pivot too. And especially as we're in the middle of spring, spring just started, we're going into summer. You know, it's getting really busy for a lot of the producers. So what would you say is some of the advice that you're sharing with your members as the season starts to pick up? Everything gets a little bit more hectic and busy. Being able to kind of stay ahead of the curve and be able to plan ahead when possible.
Alice Varon: [00:22:37] Yeah. I think one thing that is helpful for, I mean, a farmers need to plan well before spring. So the planning that's being, you know, right now they're implementing plans, but in general, I think it's always good for farms to diversify their operations as much as they can. And I see our members doing that with the addition, for many, the core is mixed vegetables, you know, diverse vegetable crops. And then adding on flowers has been very popular and a growing trend to include flowers as one of their crops, because they can be quite lucrative and it can certainly attract people to your farm stand. Also, you know, adding, expanding your garlic operation, but definitely keeping a variety of income streams on your farm. Some people do value added foods. And I think that that's always good advice, but especially in a time when there's so much uncertainty.
Allyssa Knutson: [00:23:37] And I think also if you have a seasonal product as well, if you're a seasonal farm, trying to be strategic, knowing that you need that recurring cash flow throughout the year. So figuring out a way to add in additional product offerings or incorporate subscriptions or bundle boxes are kind of getting creative with it as well.
Alice Varon: [00:23:55] Absolutely. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. I was just talking to a member yesterday whose primary farm operation is selling produce, but in the slower winter months, they do value added foods and confections and chocolates and breads and that's worked well. Cause then those are things you can do at any time of year. So, but adding them in the winter months when you have bandwidth for it is a good way to keep that income stream.
Allyssa Knutson: [00:24:20] And to engage with your, your buyers as well too, during that time.
Alice Varon: [00:24:23] Yeah.
Allyssa Knutson: [00:24:24] Before we sign off, Alice, I truly have enjoyed just listening to you and hearing more about CNG. It's been a great conversation. Is there one final piece of advice that you have for our listeners or maybe an exciting update for CNG? Anything top of mind for you before we sign off here?
Alice Varon: [00:24:41] Well, I think what I would want to share is that
Alice Varon - CNG: [00:24:44] The pandemic, I think, has made folks more selective about where their food comes from. And sometimes it's, you know, they're even more conscious about its impact on their health. So I think farmers really want to think about tapping into this desire for higher quality food by earning a certification.
Alice Varon: [00:25:01] And I know there's many, many farms who you know, make claims, but by verifying your farming practices, meet high standards.
Alice Varon - CNG: [00:25:09] And by making your certification visible, you can set your farm products apart from the rest.
Alice Varon: [00:25:15] And by doing this, you not only help your Farm's business prospects but you also raise awareness about the existence of such standards, it should in the long run, helped drive demand for better food and that in turn will help us all move towards a more sustainable food system. Your certification really not just helps your farm, but it helps raise awareness and make makes better change for better food and a more sustainable food system, which is I think what we all want.
Allyssa Knutson: [00:25:47] For sure for buyers and for producers as well. I think it helps everybody all around. It's a win-win for sure. No one would argue that quality food is not something that we want. I think we all would want that. So definitely a step in the right direction and I think awareness is the first step towards that. So definitely focusing on increasing that awareness around those options and buying local encouraging folks to buy local as well.
Well, thank you so much, Alice, for joining us today. Truly enjoyed the conversation. So thank you again.
Alice Varon: [00:26:17] Yeah, it's been great. Thanks Alyssa. Have a good one.
Allyssa Knutson: [00:26:20] you too.
Outro